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CaptVic
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My Ride 1:2010 FLHTCUSE

My Ride 2:2007 Heritage Softail
« Reply #15 on: May 30, 2010, 04:51:50 PM »

I have had wobble before but never like this. I had the bike serviced at 1000 miles and told the shop that It had a wobble at speeds and they said they could find nothing wrong.  Was out riding with friends. (4 other hd and mine is the only one that wobble. Same road same speed. The bike has 2400 miles on it. The bar was going from stop to stop and I just could not hold it.
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Hoist!
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HBRRNYC!!!




My Ride 1:'07C FLHRSE3, BLACK ICE OF COURSE, CUSTOM 110" TC 6-SPEED! +++, "CYBIL"!!!

My Ride 2:'99 FXR3, BRIGHT & DARK CANDY BLUE W/FLAMES, 80" STAGE II EVO 5-SPEED! +++, "JOY"!!!

My Ride 3:'85 FXWG, BLACK w/CUSTOM FLAMES, 110" EVO 6-SPEED! +++, CVO STYLE!!!

My Ride 4:'08 NSMC PROSG CUSTOM FXR-BASED PRO STREET, BLACK, BOYCE FRAME, HOT 89" EVO 5-SPEED! VERY FAST!!!

My Ride 5:'09 NSMC HSTBBR CUSTOM RIGID HOISTBOBBER, SILVER METALFLAKE SOLO BATES SEAT & TIN W/BLACK WISHBONE FRAME, 80" STAGE III EVO 4-SPEED! VERY COOL!!!
« Reply #16 on: May 31, 2010, 09:05:40 AM »

I have had wobble before but never like this. I had the bike serviced at 1000 miles and told the shop that It had a wobble at speeds and they said they could find nothing wrong.  Was out riding with friends. (4 other hd and mine is the only one that wobble. Same road same speed. The bike has 2400 miles on it. The bar was going from stop to stop and I just could not hold it.

DAMN!!!! So sorry to hear this Vic! I hope you make a full recovery and suffer no lasting ill effects from it! Feel better man! And of course these assholes will tell you there's nothing wrong! "They all do that! Yep, we make a motorcycle that'll potentially kill all of you at one point or another. But hey, you're riding a bike, you got a good chance of dying on it anyway!" Nixweiss Nixweiss Nixweiss

If Willie G went down in a high speed wobble, maybe then thed do something about it!!! FTF!!! Flip-off Flip-off Flip-off Flip-off Flip-off

Hoist! It's Howie
« Last Edit: May 31, 2010, 11:53:15 AM by Hoist! » Logged

"We wanna be free to ride our machines without being hassled by The Man!!!"

Live Free or Die!!!

Zero Moderation Is Our Goal!!!

Traxxion Dynamics Suspension Rules! "It ain't braggin' if you can back it up!"
CaptVic
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My Ride 1:2010 FLHTCUSE

My Ride 2:2007 Heritage Softail
« Reply #17 on: May 31, 2010, 10:09:09 AM »

Thanks Hoist.  This is my 4th touring bike well 5 if you count the softail. I had 2 riders in front of me and two behind me.  The two that were behind me said the bike was wobbling so bad my feet were not staying on the floor boards. I am glad they total the bike, I would not have felt save on that bike again.  That said,  I think I will wait till the 2011 to come out before I replace it.
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Black Diamond
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My Ride 1:SERK4 "Lexi"

My Ride 2:84 FXRS Low Glide "Eve" (Son)

My Ride 3:03 Fat Boy "Grace" (Daughter)
« Reply #18 on: May 31, 2010, 12:41:21 PM »

Sorry to hear about your mishap.

I just got back from the Great Smoky Mountain area. Was running with Just Us 6 in the +115 mph area when I let off as a PU was in my lane and I was closing fast. Just opened my hand to let her motor brake. WOW! She started shaking front to rear. I added a little power which reduced the shake/wobble.

I have been at these speeds before with this scooter. Never a problem. Only thing I changed was the front pulley to a 30T with a new belt sized for this mod. I've had most of the C&C solo seat removed from my ass so I can still use it!

JW
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RedDevil
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My Ride 1:2011 FLTRUSE - Silent Gray Fellow

My Ride 2:2012 FLHXSE3 - Hot Citrus/Antique Gunstock
« Reply #19 on: May 31, 2010, 01:10:24 PM »

Sorry to hear about your mishap.

I just got back from the Great Smoky Mountain area. Was running with Just Us 6 in the +115 mph area when I let off as a PU was in my lane and I was closing fast. Just opened my hand to let her motor brake. WOW! She started shaking front to rear. I added a little power which reduced the shake/wobble.

I have been at these speeds before with this scooter. Never a problem. Only thing I changed was the front pulley to a 30T with a new belt sized for this mod. I've had most of the C&C solo seat removed from my ass so I can still use it!

JW

My first question would be what were you doing in the +115 mph area on a motorcycle in the first place, but whatever spins your prop...

Flaming Devil
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2011 FLTRUSE
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Black Diamond
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My Ride 1:SERK4 "Lexi"

My Ride 2:84 FXRS Low Glide "Eve" (Son)

My Ride 3:03 Fat Boy "Grace" (Daughter)
« Reply #20 on: May 31, 2010, 08:28:04 PM »

My first question would be what were you doing in the +115 mph area on a motorcycle in the first place, but whatever spins your prop...

Flaming Devil

No doubt it is not my brightest move but it does happen infrequently. I have been known to make mistakes.   Nixweiss

JW
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CaptVic
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My Ride 1:2010 FLHTCUSE

My Ride 2:2007 Heritage Softail
« Reply #21 on: June 01, 2010, 05:30:45 AM »

Same here. Nixweiss
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J-Carr
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That's what she said




My Ride 1:2008 FLHTCUSE3 Canyon Copper & Stardust Silver with SEAC, SSERT, and Fulsac 1.75" Slip Ons.  "Screamin' Nemo"

My Ride 2:1966 Road Queen Dori all original parts with some removed for better performance. "Screamin' Malinda"
« Reply #22 on: June 01, 2010, 06:47:10 AM »

We all make mistakes but Howie's right on the money... They have to fix the wobble.  I guess the '09 and newer frame is supposed to but I've still heard of some people complaining.

Regardless Vic, get better quick!

Ride Safe,
JC
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My Ride 1:2005 FLHTCSE2 Cherry
« Reply #23 on: June 01, 2010, 07:47:41 AM »

We all make mistakes but Howie's right on the money... They have to fix the wobble.  I guess the '09 and newer frame is supposed to but I've still heard of some people complaining.

Regardless Vic, get better quick!

Ride Safe,
JC

The new frame and swingarm combination does seem to make a significant difference in the rear steer problem, but the front end high speed wobble tendencies of the Electraglide weren't really addressed in the '09 changes.  The steering head rake is still very steep, the fork mounted fairing still applies forces to the front end that aren't offset by anything other than the gyroscopic effect of the wheel (no steering damper), etc. 

I guess we could all just "tsk tsk" folks for riding over 60 mph and thus opening themselves up to the possibility of their Harley spitting them off, but on the other hand I believe it's the manufacturer's responsibility to make the machine stable at any speed it can attain.  If the clowns in Milwaukee can't figure out how to do it, they need to radically lower the speed capability to match the capabilities (or lack thereof) of the chassis.  Of course, just adding an electronic governor like many auto's do won't help much, since the first thing folks have to do to make a Harley run decent is to get a tuning device and the first thing to be changed would be any top speed limit, no doubt in my mind.  So perhaps what H-D needs to do is to revert back to the powertrain that would automatically limit speeds to match the capabilities of the chassis.  Coming soon to a dealer near you, the all new 2011 Panhead Electraglide.  Combined with the near 1000 pound weight of the bike, the anemic power output should finally put the Electraglide high speed wobble to rest.   


Jerry
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J-Carr
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My Ride 1:2008 FLHTCUSE3 Canyon Copper & Stardust Silver with SEAC, SSERT, and Fulsac 1.75" Slip Ons.  "Screamin' Nemo"

My Ride 2:1966 Road Queen Dori all original parts with some removed for better performance. "Screamin' Malinda"
« Reply #24 on: June 01, 2010, 09:12:54 AM »

The new frame and swingarm combination does seem to make a significant difference in the rear steer problem, but the front end high speed wobble tendencies of the Electraglide weren't really addressed in the '09 changes.  The steering head rake is still very steep, the fork mounted fairing still applies forces to the front end that aren't offset by anything other than the gyroscopic effect of the wheel (no steering damper), etc. 

I guess we could all just "tsk tsk" folks for riding over 60 mph and thus opening themselves up to the possibility of their Harley spitting them off, but on the other hand I believe it's the manufacturer's responsibility to make the machine stable at any speed it can attain.  If the clowns in Milwaukee can't figure out how to do it, they need to radically lower the speed capability to match the capabilities (or lack thereof) of the chassis.  Of course, just adding an electronic governor like many auto's do won't help much, since the first thing folks have to do to make a Harley run decent is to get a tuning device and the first thing to be changed would be any top speed limit, no doubt in my mind.  So perhaps what H-D needs to do is to revert back to the powertrain that would automatically limit speeds to match the capabilities of the chassis.  Coming soon to a dealer near you, the all new 2011 Panhead Electraglide.  Combined with the near 1000 pound weight of the bike, the anemic power output should finally put the Electraglide high speed wobble to rest.   


Jerry
Jerry, I ride as conservatively as anyone on this site.  Not because I can't ride fast, but because I choose to ride slow.  But even my definition of slow has had me get some wobble.  Letting off from 75 mph through a sweeper because of a sudden traffic switch.  Not braking, just backing off the throttle.  So making the a governer that keeps bikes below what in some states is the legal speed limit isn't an answer.

I know you were being facitious but this is one of those per peeves of mine.  Fortunately I didn't always realize I like to cruise slow and enjoy the country I'm riding through.  So I know how to ride stupid fast and I'm not afraid of the throttle when I need it.  I gassed out of the wobble, crawled up the offending cars bumper did a semi lane split to get around and pulled away safely.  But not everyone has that experience.

What really troubles me is that my buddy got it on a Road King.  Howie's had it on a Road King.  It's not (just) the fairing.  Howie's redone the front end to the point that I'd have to believe that it's a right as engineering allows.  So where's the answer?  Rake it out some and kill the slow speed manuvering that a touring frame alows?  I don't have the answer, but I do expect better from the people who SHOULD know what to do.  The people who design them.

Ride Safe,
JC
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Hoist!
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HBRRNYC!!!




My Ride 1:'07C FLHRSE3, BLACK ICE OF COURSE, CUSTOM 110" TC 6-SPEED! +++, "CYBIL"!!!

My Ride 2:'99 FXR3, BRIGHT & DARK CANDY BLUE W/FLAMES, 80" STAGE II EVO 5-SPEED! +++, "JOY"!!!

My Ride 3:'85 FXWG, BLACK w/CUSTOM FLAMES, 110" EVO 6-SPEED! +++, CVO STYLE!!!

My Ride 4:'08 NSMC PROSG CUSTOM FXR-BASED PRO STREET, BLACK, BOYCE FRAME, HOT 89" EVO 5-SPEED! VERY FAST!!!

My Ride 5:'09 NSMC HSTBBR CUSTOM RIGID HOISTBOBBER, SILVER METALFLAKE SOLO BATES SEAT & TIN W/BLACK WISHBONE FRAME, 80" STAGE III EVO 4-SPEED! VERY COOL!!!
« Reply #25 on: June 01, 2010, 09:16:05 AM »

115 is NO MISTAKE!!! First off, just cause you have a 55 or 65 MPH speed limit, doesn't mean it's not higher, or even non-existent in other locales. The speedos all go to 120. Every component of the bike like the tires, the engine, the gearing,etc, are made to perform at these speeds. HD's problem is they designed this thing when these speeds weren't achievable, but never changed the basic design. Don't ask me how they put these things under Highway Patrols asses! Risky business for the MoCo if you ask me! They changed the '09's CAUSE THEY'RE CHEAPER TO BUILD, not to fix a wobble. They'll NEVER admit to that wobble. You don't de-rake a bike for high speed performance! Not, like Jerry said, without adding some type of stabilization! Yeah, the design is great for parade duty and all that Ride Like A Pro crap! But not for high speed straight line riding! You don't see drag bikes with a 26 deg rake!!! f$#@ing douche bags!!! Express Express Express Angry Angry Angry

I hope the TriGlide steering damper I installed does the trick. Should get Cybil back shortly, and I'll let ya'll know how it worked out! Wink

Hoist! It's Howie
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"We wanna be free to ride our machines without being hassled by The Man!!!"

Live Free or Die!!!

Zero Moderation Is Our Goal!!!

Traxxion Dynamics Suspension Rules! "It ain't braggin' if you can back it up!"
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My Ride 1:2005 FLHTCSE2 Cherry
« Reply #26 on: June 01, 2010, 01:58:27 PM »


JC, you're right, I was being facetious, cynical, and sarcastic all in one post.  Kind of my normal mode, now that I think about it. 

The Road King shares most of the components of the Electraglide, including the inherently unstable front end.  One has a fork mounted windshield, the other a fork mounted fairing.  Both have higher than normal rates of wobble, going back as many years as I've been involved with Harley's and probably many more.  Harley management cannot claim ignorance, they've been sued more times than probably any manufacturer over this particular issue.  And they've agreed to a lot of settlements with those nice "nondisclosure" features, so the public never gets to see the evidence laid out in a courtroom.  I would guess that they know exactly what it would take to fix the problem, but they also have no intention of doing anything that will be an obvious admission that the current design is unstable.  For instance, they might put a stabilizer on the Trike, since they can always argue it's a totally different animal, but they'll never add one to the 2 wheeled Touring models.  Same with changing the front end geometry to a more stable (but less maneuverable for parade mode) design.


Jerry
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RedDevil
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My Ride 1:2011 FLTRUSE - Silent Gray Fellow

My Ride 2:2012 FLHXSE3 - Hot Citrus/Antique Gunstock
« Reply #27 on: June 01, 2010, 03:19:48 PM »

Don't get me wrong folks, driving slower is not the answer to a design fault on the MoCo's part. Someone hit it on the head before.  The MoCo probably won't do anything about it until Willy G goes through a tank slapper once and complains about it. 

I wasn't speaking just Harleys when I question 115mph on the highway. I question going that on any motorcycle regardless of the posted speed limit.  I was talking to a guy down in Florida a while back that had a twin turbo'd Hyabusa (dumb IMO) and asked him what the top end was on it.  He said all he knows it will go fast enough for $2400 and a six month suspended license.   Shocked 

Flaming Devil
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2011 FLTRUSE
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Black Diamond
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My Ride 1:SERK4 "Lexi"

My Ride 2:84 FXRS Low Glide "Eve" (Son)

My Ride 3:03 Fat Boy "Grace" (Daughter)
« Reply #28 on: June 01, 2010, 09:53:55 PM »

It seems strange to me that this wobble goblin makes an appearance after 30,000 miles. I've been riding this scooter, and all my other scooters the same way for years. It is upsetting that this can occur out of the blue.

I'll have the neck bearing and swingarm bushings checked and replaces as necessary. But how will I know it's fixed. I've never had it happen before so ....

JW
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Black Diamond
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My Ride 1:SERK4 "Lexi"

My Ride 2:84 FXRS Low Glide "Eve" (Son)

My Ride 3:03 Fat Boy "Grace" (Daughter)
« Reply #29 on: June 01, 2010, 09:56:36 PM »

Don't get me wrong folks, driving slower is not the answer to a design fault on the MoCo's part. Someone hit it on the head before.  The MoCo probably won't do anything about it until Willy G goes through a tank slapper once and complains about it. 

I wasn't speaking just Harleys when I question 115mph on the highway. I question going that on any motorcycle regardless of the posted speed limit.  I was talking to a guy down in Florida a while back that had a twin turbo'd Hyabusa (dumb IMO) and asked him what the top end was on it.  He said all he knows it will go fast enough for $2400 and a six month suspended license.   Shocked 

Flaming Devil

RedDevil

I respect your opinion about the speed as well as your right to express it. We all make decisions we are responsible for!

JW
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